My parents were so opposite of the principles of a Taken In Hand relationship. My father bent to whatever whim my mother decided to utter. She didn't have the wisdom, strength or foresight to lead, but she controlled the show. I guess he didn't have the confidence to take it away from her. When he did make a decision, she would always second guess him, which further destroyed his confidence.

I learned a great deal from watching them relate. I learned that I didn't want what they had. I don't think that either of them was a very happy person.

On the other hand, what I believe that my mother sorely needed was a sore bottom from a firm handed husband who wouldn't put up with her nonsense. Unfortunately, my father never had the sense of purpose to overcome her and bring her under control.

Sam (of Sam & Missy)

I don't think a woman can actually be overcome though unless she wants to be. If your mother didn't want to be and your father had tried that, it would have got him nowhere. Spanking a woman who just doesn't want to be spanked would probably just piss her off. It might have made your parents marriage worse rather than better. If you don't want to be Taken In Hand, then you won't be.

I think it depends on the mental state of the person comitting suicide. If the person is in their right mind, then I think they should consider the effect that it will have on those left behind. The surviving relatives and friends must inevitably be left wondering what, if anything, they could have done to prevent the suicide, why the person committing it didn't tell them how unhappy he was etc. I know if any of my children committed suicide I would be absolutely devestated, I would spend the rest of my life wondering what I could have done to prevent it, I would never, never get over it. "Why, why, why?" I would be asking that question until I died.

If it's clinical depression then I suppose that it's really difficult to overcome the impulse to do it unless you're on medication. But then I think I'd try to make sure that the suicidal person did take his medication. Better to have him alive on medication than dead off it, I think would be my thought.

As for this kneeling at the feet thing, I don't really fancy it myself. But then I'm not into feet at all. I don't want to kneel at anyone's feet, and I don't want anyone kneeling at mine either. I'm just not a foot person.

HELLO!!! I am new here- trying to read all these fascinating posts. My husband and I are trying to work on making this "Taken in Hand" mode of thinking work for us. It makes so much sense~ so natural, etc. I am glad I found this place. (I thought I was a freak, but since coming here I feel a little better) (I'm still a freak, just not a lonely one anymore!!! HA HA!!). Anyway, I can relate to the "physically lower" part of the boss's post. I don't sit at my husbands' feet, (not that I wouldn't, I just haven't ever thought of it,) however, he does like me to sleep lower than him in the bed. My pillow goes beneath his arm, so that when I lay on it my head is just below his chest, my arm wraps around his belly.

That is how we sleep every night. I realize this would never work for some people, because they need space when they sleep, or for various other reasons, but we like to be close and sleep wrapped around each other most of every night. The hardest part of this is when I am upset with him (or pouting), he still requires me to snug right up to him like this, like it or not. It's a hard thing to overcome, because when I am mad at him, the last thing I want to do is TOUCH him. But of course, if he puts his foot down, which lately he is getting very good at, I do it. ;~}

The other night I had more burdens than I could handle. Worries over nearly adult children, work troubles, mother troubles and a friend in the hospital with an illness that is very complex and potentially life threatening. After dinner the seating arrangements in the living room were such that I couldn't sit by my husband.

Normally when I'm feeling overwhelmed and lost I'll lie on the couch and put my head in his lap but our teenage sons were taking up that end of the couch so finally in desperation I just dropped to my knees in front of him and put my head on one of his knees and said "I've just had such a terrible day!" I think I frightened everyone.

Hubby just stroked my hair and in a few minutes he announced "I think it's time for bed!" I'm sure the kids were thinking "Whoa! What's wrong with Mom?!" They both made sure to hug me goodnight which as teenagers is not as common a bedtime ritual as it used to be. Regardless of their reactions, I needed comfort and found it kneeling at my husband's feet.

What message this sends to my sons, I can't say. I hope that it sends the message that a husband sometimes needs to be a port in the storm for his wife and if she needs to express it at his feet then that should be ok with him.

So maybe your mother was secretly yearning for a dominant man then? That's sad.

But then Rhett Butler doesn't get it right, does he? There's Scarlett all glowing and happy after their night of passion together and he just sweeps in and starts being horrible to her and ruins it all. He doesn't even notice that she is all aglow and that now is the moment to move in and make her his. Instead he starts being vile. And then he takes their daughter and goes off travelling, leaving her to start yearning over Ashely again. Hopeless.

Gosh! Exploring, to the point of fully understanding, my parent's relationship and the effect, or lack thereof, that it had on myself, my siblings and our various relationships, would probably entail years of study, therapy and deep introspection. Probably not a bad idea, but in the interst of brevity, I'll try to refrain from getting too involved here.

My parent's relationship was tempestuous. My father was definitely a dominant figure, but not in a very positive way. He was controlling and often verbally abusive to my mother. Alcohol often exacerbated that trait. To his children he was distant. A disciplinarian who tried in vain to control his large brood of artistic, energetic, headstrong Irish offspring. Though my mother often defered to him in public settings, playing the role of the perfect companion to a succesful executive, exuding a quiet class and charm when the situation warranted such; back at the ranch she undermined his athority by secretly telling us to pay him no mind and to ignore his threats and demands. Of course we preffered her gentle and permissive brand of parenting over his, so we basically tried to stay out of his way while doing pretty much whatever we pleased, as did she. It wasn't, in my opinion, a succesful relationship, nor a positive parenting situation.

I know very little of my grandparent's realtionships for various reasons. So, I doubt their relationships had much impact on mine. I do however belive that our ancestries have some impact and influence in our lives, even if we are unaware of it.

While still not entirely comfortable with the word submissive in terms of describing myself, I do think that I was simply born with a more gentle and giving nature than were the rest of my siblings. While the other girls were rough housing with the boys, I quietly enjoyed tea parties with my dolls, dresses, jewelry, everything feminine and refined. I loved assisting my mother with the household chores and in caring for my only younger sibling. I even, inspite of father's lack of affection, would often sit at his feet once he'd settled himself in his favorite chair and offer to take his shoes and get his slippers. Where did that come from?! ::laughs::

Because of that inherent nature, my father did tend to be a little more gentle and a little less demnding with me than with my siblings. Maybe I just learned early on that you catch more flies with honey. I really don't know. It just came naturally to me.

Unfortunately, the lack of direction and loving discipline in my life caused me to drift from what I believe was my truer nature and to become somewhat rebellious, impetuous and very independant. Not all bad; those traits helped me to become the intelligent, successful woman I am today. My problem is that I've always sensed that I lost something along the way and now, finally, I think I've found it and am working at "connecting with my inner child" and implementing the things I need into my long term, committed marriage to the man I love.

It's slow going, but we're learning. He once said I was the strongest person he knew, so brnging our relationship to a point where he feels, and rightly so, that he is the stronger one, or at least strong enough for a woman like me to be completely at ease defering to him as HOH, is a challenge. I love him for being willing to try, and being patient with me while I explore and come to terms with my needs.

My mother was conflicting. She raised me alone. She is a strong, independent woman, but when I started seriously dating, and when I got married, she encouraged (demanded sometimes) that "nice girls", or "girls men want" behave, dress, have their make up, and their nails, a "certain way". Huh?

I always wondered...stand up for what I believe in, but change myself, alter my body, my political and religious beliefs, because some guy says I have to? I had a job at a library, and my boyfriend picked me up, we had a "date", which to him, meant sex, and then he dropped me off at my car on a snowy night, and left in his truck. My car got stuck (this is pre-cell phone days), and I walked two miles in the snow, in heels, and when I got home my mother said, "Well, if you'd given him what he needed maybe he'd have waited to see if you got out okay." What? Then, when it came time to shop for special occasion dresses she would say, "Nothing black, nothing above the knee, you don't want him to think you're a slut!"

Grandma was different. Grandma pretty much catered to her husband, but she was a brilliant woman. She did what she did, she loved him, but she was not a doormat, and she was competent to run his business after he died for nearly twenty years. She was, and will forever be, my hero...red lipstick and all! (Red lipstick is only for sluts according to my mother). Go figure.

I'm just me. I like to submit to my husband, I have had to learn how to enjoy being respected. It's a process, but I don't think it's anyone's fault I am the way I am...fault implies there is something wrong with me. And, for today, I'm doing okay.

Kal

My father was the head of the house, no doubt to anyone who knew our family. He was an active member of our community and in both circles of our lives he was in charge. My mother, who always talked tough when my dad wasn’t around, was completely submissive to him when they were together.

I have so many memories of her deferring to him. At the time, I rebelled against it. I found his hold over my mother wrong and I was determined to never let a man make me do anything I didn’t want to. At the moment, I can’t remember such a poignant memory as yours the boss, but the consistency with which my mom became submissive with my father is what made it clear to me. He was very authoritative, and it appeared to me that it was a given to him that she do what he said. That point really bothered me when I was younger. It did have an affect, but that affect has changed. I used to find it wrong, but now it feels so right.

The memories of my parent’s relationship helped me through my realization that my husband deserved my respect and devotion in ways other than occasional appreciation. I think my mom gave herself to my father because he deserved it. He was always there. He cared about us and kept us safe. He worked hard and rarely complained. Her respect of his decisions was like no other relationships I encountered. He was full of chivalry and my mom was melted by it. All these things describe my husband, and just as my mom chose to give herself to my dad, I have chosen to give myself to my husband.

My parents had a beautiful relationship together, it worked for them. That’s all that matters. What ever you call it, or even if you don’t give this lifestyle a name, they displayed the sentiment behind taken in hand. Whether my dad spanked my mom, I don’t know. I do remember a time when she got a little feisty with him and she turned to her sister and said with a little giggle “I think I’m in trouble”.

Kaylee

I come from a "traditional" family. My father was always very much the head of the household. My mother, while somewhat subservient, was strong in her own way. They had (still have) a very harmonious marriage. I've never seen my father hit (or spank) my mother.

I suppose the way I was raised may have had some influence on why I turned out "this way". I'm pretty sure, however, that I was like this from the start. I remember having what I'd now call "submissive" fantasies starting from a very young age - maybe four or five. (I had "dominant" fantasies as well, but they went away after awhile). Of course, my socialization/exposure to my parents' way of relating to each other *could* have kicked in by then, but I'm reasonably sure that I would have turned out like this regardless of how I was raised.